The i-Technology Media!
Register | Log in
   
 
.NET  ·  AJAX  ·  CLOUD  ·  ECLIPSE  ·  FLEX  ·  OPEN WEB  ·  iPHONE  ·  JAVA  ·  LINUX  ·  OPEN SOURCE  ·  ORACLE  ·  PBDJ  ·  SEARCH  ·  SILVERLIGHT  ·  SOA  ·  VIRTUALIZATION  ·  WEB 2.0  ·  WIRELESS  ·  XML
Comments
Google Wave Invitation Giveaway
By Aditya Banerjee
Timo Hirvonen wrote: I would really appreciate an invitation. Been desperately trying to find one :) timo [dot] hirvonen [at] gmail [dot]com
Nov. 27, 2009 11:13 AM EST
Cloud Expo on Google News
Did you read today's front page stories & breaking news?


2009 East
PLATINUM SPONSORS:
IBM
Smarter Business Solutions Through Dynamic Infrastructure
IBM
Smarter Insights: How the CIO Becomes a Hero Again
Microsoft
Windows Azure
GOLD SPONSORS:
Appsense
Why VDI?
CA
Maximizing the Business Value of Virtualization in Enterprise and Cloud Computing Environments
ExactTarget
Messaging in the Cloud - Email, SMS and Voice
Freedom OSS
Stairway to the Cloud
Sun
Sun's Incubation Platform: Helping Startups Serve the Enterprise
POWER PANELS:
Cloud Computing & Enterprise IT: Cost & Operational Benefits
How and Why is a Flexible IT Infrastructure the Key To the Future?
Click For 2008 West
Event Webcasts

2009 East
GOLD SPONSORS:
CA
Get Your Transactions Under Control: SOA Performance Management
Software AG
Performance Driven Adoption: The Secret to Advancing SOA
Intel
The Evolving SOA Appliance: 3 Game-Changing Innovations
SILVER SPONSOR:
Denodo
Data Mashups: Deliver Your Project Faster with Virtualized Data Services Across Internal & External Sources
POWER PANELS:
The Business Value of Service Orientation
Driving Profitability Through User Experience
Click For 2008 West
Event Webcasts
Live Google News by SYS-CON!
Top Three Links You Must Click On


Java
"Letting Java Go" - James Gosling in 2003 on Open-Sourcing Java
"If we really let it go, what would happen?" asked James Gosling, at last year's JavaOne.

By: Java News Desk
Feb. 15, 2004 12:00 AM

  • Read Eric S. Raymond's open letter to Scott McNealy, "Let Java Go"

    When asked by a Computerworld reporter back in June 2003 what the latest thinking was at Sun on making Java open-source, Gosling replied:

    "I am certainly one of the people who would love to make it open-source. But it's hard for two reasons. One is that open-source ways of dealing with software work really well so long as you get this sort of collegial atmosphere. If you happen to have a bully on the block who is really strong, it really doesn't work. We have this history of having been victimized, and there are lots of people who are nervous about that."

    "The other issue," Gosling continued, "is that when you've got a platform technology like Java, there are really two sides to the community. There are the people who are building the platform, and the people who are using the platform."

    "From the point of view of the people who are using the platform, one of the most valuable things about Java is the consistency, the interoperability. And from the platform providers' side of the world, they feel it's this sort of tension. On the one hand, they just want to go off and do whatever they damn well please. On the other hand, they know that if they did that, they'd be cutting themselves off from some developers."

    "Being involved with interoperability is something that most manufacturers have this love-hate thing with," Gosling added. "So we've tended to have our licenses be as close to open-source as we can be, while maintaining the one thing that we really care about, which is interoperability."

    Given those arguments he'd adduced himself, he was then asked: do you still favor open-source for Java?

    "I believe all of those arguments are actually correct," he replied. "The question for me is, have we gotten to a point where market pressures will enforce the values of the developer community? Are we someplace where there's no one player who could just take over and be the bully on the block? And I think we're basically there. But different people have different opinions on that."

    Could Java go open-source soon, he was asked. (Remember, this was June 2003.) "It could conceivably happen soon," sais Gosling, "although Sun is kind of a funny company. I don't really know what the right word is. We aren't like a dictatorship. We don't have somebody in the center that's the ultimate control. We aren't like a really hierarchical company. We're a consensus company, which in some ways is lovely and in some ways is completely maddening."

    Gosling concluded: "And this has been a point on which I think everybody agrees on the basic arguments about why we need to protect [Java], and I buy those arguments. The question is then, How do you enforce that? And right now, the argument is mostly, Are we there yet? If we really let it go, what would happen? And there are enough people that are pretty nervous. Right now, that's kind of where the consensus is, but it's slowly been inching away."

  • Published Feb. 15, 2004— Reads 43,483 — Feedback 7
    Copyright © 2004 SYS-CON Media, Inc. — All Rights Reserved.
    Syndicated stories and blog feeds, all rights reserved by the author.
    Related Stories
    ▪ JDJ Exclusive: Scott McNealy's 2004 Predictions
    ▪ Where Is i-Technology Going in 2004?
    ▪ Sun's Gosling: "Our Future is NetBeans"
    ▪ Flashback to '04: "Let Java Go" – ESR Writes Open Letter to Sun
    ▪ "No Sun Is An Island," Says Javalobby Founder
    ▪ Flashback to '04: Now Come the Counter-Arguments Against Open-Sourcing Java
    ▪ Flashback to '04: IBM to Sun – "Let's Collaborate on Open-Sourcing Java"
    ▪ Java in the News
    ▪ "We Have Not Sold Our Soul to the Dark Side" - Gosling on Sun/MSFT Pact
    ▪ "Sun Should Make Java a True Open Standard," IBM Repeats
    ▪ Flashback to '04: Gosling Says "Open-Sourcing Java Could Promote Interoperability"
    ▪ Sun Will Open-Source Java "Today, Tomorrow or Two Years Down the Road"
    ▪ Open-Source Java? "The Debate is Still Going On, Fast and Furious," Says Gosling
    ▪ Is Java Bigger than Sun? - The Java Ecosystem Debates the Future of Java
    ▪ Developer Viewpoint: Open-Source Not Java Itself...but "JRT"
    ▪ Sun Turns J2SE Into Laboratory For New Java Licensing Experiment
    Related Links
    ▪ James Gosling's blog at java.net
    ▪ JAG's bio
    ▪ James's page devoted to Deutsch's Fallacies of Distributed Compu
    About Java News Desk
    JDJ News Desk monitors the world of Java to present IT professionals with updates on technology advances, business trends, new products and standards in the Java and i-technology space.

    Add Your Feedback

    In order to post a comment you need to be registered and logged in.

    Register | Sign-in

    Reader Feedback: Page 1 of 1

    #7
    Paul Hobbs commented on 1 Mar 2004

    The SUN brand gives the product credability, besides we have more than enough open-source development kits.

    #6
    carld commented on 20 Feb 2004

    What are the fears or main reason to Open Source?
    Is it for market position?
    Is it for many minds focusing on new ideas?
    Is it forking the language?
    Is it because everyone wants to bite the hand that feed em?
    Is it branding?

    I think we should leave it be for now.
    And have a better voting methodology for bug parade and JCP.
    Preserve a good thing... (WORA)
    Why was this a good thing 3-4 years ago, and now it doesn''t really make a whole lot difference. When you open source it, it is really for the API developers. Those are the folks who are want permission to mess with the underlying implementation (JNI,C,C++). I believe that many Users of the API want to jump on the band wagon, and may not realize what is good for the platform. When you fork the JVM it would be called XVM or XYZVM?

    Just becareful what you wish for...

    -Carl

    -Carl

    #5
    Ray commented on 17 Feb 2004

    My company has concentrated exclusively on Java development since 1998. I know what''s good about it and I know its weak points, probably as well as Sun''s internal Java team does. Open source would kill it, and anyone who thinks otherwise is just too short-sighted to be making such a significant decision. I''d give Sun a billion dollars for Java before I''d let them open source it.

    #4
    Scott Sauyet commented on 17 Feb 2004

    > The advantage of this would be that it would allow other
    > groups to do a fork if they wanted to, without losing the
    > official Sun brand of Java...

    However, I think a fork is exactly what Gosling is saying Sun fears. Right or wrong, this is an understandable concern. Java has managed to make it as far as it has in part because the community has never been able to become fractured.

    I think that Eric Raymond is right, and the time is right to release Java, but I certainly understand the concerns.

    #3
    David Fraser commented on 17 Feb 2004

    The trouble with this argument is that it assumes "open-source" and "community-driven management" are the same thing. It would still be possible to move to an open source license, but keep the management structure controlled by Sun. The advantage of this would be that it would allow other groups to do a fork if they wanted to, without losing the official Sun brand of Java...

    #2
    jay commented on 15 Feb 2004

    Yeah right: and Sun was going to do it in 1998 too, if one believed the Wired report of the time ("Open-Source Java at Last?" by Niall McKay.)

    #1
    ashishK commented on 15 Feb 2004

    "Sun should go for broke on open-source Java and scare Microsoft away in the bargain." So said Nicholas Petreley, founding editor of LinuxWorld


    Subscribe to the World's Most Powerful Newsletters
    Subscribe to Our Rss Feeds & Get Your SYS-CON News Live!
    Click to Add our RSS Feeds to the Service of Your Choice:
    Google Reader or Homepage Add to My Yahoo! Subscribe with Bloglines Subscribe in NewsGator Online
    myFeedster Add to My AOL Subscribe in Rojo Add 'Hugg' to Newsburst from CNET News.com Kinja Digest View Additional SYS-CON Feeds
    Publish Your Article! Please send it to editorial(at)sys-con.com!

    Advertise on this site! Contact advertising(at)sys-con.com! 201 802-3021

    SYS-CON Featured Whitepapers

    ADS BY GOOGLE

    Breaking Java News
    The Week Ahead for The Department of Justice for November 30 - December 4, 2009
    Government of Canada, Government of Yukon and Communities Support Improvements to Recreational Facilities in Yukon
    Norstar Securities Trust Announces Third Quarter Results
    Canadian Pacific announces industry-leading biodiesel testing underway
    Burnsville, MN Mayor Elizabeth Kautz Represents U.S. Mayors at EUROCITIES Meeting
    LG Electronics Canada Welcomes Formula 1(TM) Back to Montreal
    FDA Approves Agriflu Seasonal Influenza Vaccine
    Source Gold Corp. Identifies High Grade Gold and Copper From Initial Sampling Program
    Advant-e Corporation Provides Update on Previously Announced Ten-for-One Forward Stock Split and $2 Million Cash Dividend
    MHI to Launch New Company Dedicated to Compressor Business; Target Set on Joining Global Top Three

    ADVERTISE   |   MAGAZINE SUBSCRIPTIONS   |   FREE BREAKING-NEWSLETTERS!   |   SYS-CON.TV   |   BLOG-N-PLAY!   |   WEBCAST   |   EDUCATION   |   RESEARCH

    .NET Developer's Journal - .NETDJ   |   ColdFusion Developer's Journal - CFDJ   |   Eclipse Developer's Journal - EDJ   |   Enterprise Open Source Magazine - EOS
    Open Web Developer's Journal - OPENWEB   |   iPhone Developer's Journal - iPHONE   |   Virtualization - Virtualization   |   Java Developer's Journal - JDJ   |   Linux.SYS-CON.com
    PowerBuilder Developer's Journal - PBDJ   |   SEO / SEM Journal - SJ   |   SOAWorld Magazine - SOAWM   |   IT Solutions Guide - ITSG   |   Symbian Developer's Journal - SDJ
    WebLogic Developer's Journal - WLDJ   |   WebSphere Journal - WJ   |   Wireless Business & Technology - WBT   |   XML-Journal - XMLJ   |   Internet Video - iTV
    Flex Developer's Journal - Flex   |   AJAXWorld Magazine - AWM   |   Silverlight Developer's Journal - SLDJ   |   PHP.SYS-CON.com   |   Web 2.0 Journal - WEB2
    Apache   |   CMS   |   CRM   |   HP   |   Oracle Journal   |   Perl   |   Python   |   Red Hat   |   Ruby on Rails   |   SAP   |   SaaS

    SYS-CON MEDIA:   ABOUT US   |   CONTACT US   |   COMPANY NEWS   |   CAREERS   |   SITE MAP
    SYS-CON EVENTS:   |  AJAXWorld Conference & Expo  |  iPhone Developer Summit  |  Cloud Computing Conference & Expo  |  SOA World Conference & Expo  |  Virtualization Conference & Expo
    INTERNATIONAL SITES:   India  |  U.K.  |  Canada  |  Germany  |  France  |  Australia  |  Italy  |  Spain  |  Netherlands  |  Brazil  |  Belgium
     Terms of Use & Our Privacy Statement     About Newsfeeds / Video Feeds
    Copyright ©1994-2008 SYS-CON Publications, Inc. All Rights Reserved. All marks are trademarks of SYS-CON Media.
    Reproduction in whole or in part in any form or medium without express written permission of SYS-CON Publications, Inc. is prohibited.
     
    close this window